On Wednesday, March 3, 2004, at 02:10  PM, Blake Ashley wrote:

> How did you get those pewter rings on?  They look great!
>

I learned this trick from Scott Grandstaff a couple of years ago. As he 
explained it to me:

In the lathe, cut a groove in the wood about 1/4" wide and 1/4" deep. 
Use a couple of layers of masking tape around the groove, which will 
serve as the form for the liquid pewter you are going to pour in. Make 
a hole in the top of the tape. The masking tape will not burn when you 
pour in the pewter.

Pewter is easy to melt with a propane torch and a tin can.

I found that I like to make a small mouth out of putty around the hole 
in the tape so that when the liquid metal solidifies and shrinks there 
will be enough metal to file off and not be too low.

You need to make the pewter ring about an eighth bigger in diameter 
than what you want it to finish at so you will have metal to cut down 
to size. I find that it is easy to make the groove in the wood too 
narrow, and this lets the pewter get bubbles in it which can't get out.

You would think that molten pewter would burn the wood, but it doesn't. 
Let it cool by itself, no water!

The solidified pewter cuts very easily with ordinary lathe tools.

Scott has found a source for tin, which is what pewter actually is, at 
about $8 a pound. I keep an eye out for junk pewter at estate sales and 
fleas and get it for a lot less.

You can also make inlays by undercutting the area the pewter will go 
into so it can't fall out. Then file it down and polish it.

Jim Thompson, the old millrat in Riverside, CA

The pieces I have found were marked "Pewter" on the bottom.

  Actually I have to admit that if it isn't marked, I don't know how to 
identify it.  My SWMBO can tell at a glance though, and I rely on her.

Maybe somebody else can answer this better.

On Wednesday, March 3, 2004, at 07:14  PM, Larry Marshall wrote:

>
>> Scott has found a source for tin, which is what pewter actually
>> is, at about $8 a pound. I keep an eye out for junk pewter at
>> estate sales and fleas and get it for a lot less.
>
> Jim, how does one identify 'pure' pewter at a flea market?  I've got
> to try this.
>
Jim Thompson, the old millrat in Riverside, CA

It seems that every time I need materials that are hard to find, I go to
http://www.mcmaster.com/ . They have Pewter  along with the casting putty.

Col. Dick Hucker (Huck)
Dyer, Indiana

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Larry Marshall" 
To: "oldtools" 
Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 7:14 PM
Subject: Re: [oldtools] Pewter rings

>
> > Scott has found a source for tin, which is what pewter actually
> > is, at about $8 a pound. I keep an eye out for junk pewter at
> > estate sales and fleas and get it for a lot less.
>
> Jim, how does one identify 'pure' pewter at a flea market?  I've got
> to try this.
>
> -- 
> Cheers --- Larry Marshall
> Quebec City, QC
> http://www.woodnbits.com
>
> Archive: http://www.frontier.iarc.uaf.edu/~cswingle/archive/
> To unsubscribe or change options, use the web interface:
>     http://galoots.law.cornell.edu:81/read/?forum=oldtools

> Scott has found a source for tin, which is what pewter actually
> is, at about $8 a pound. I keep an eye out for junk pewter at
> estate sales and fleas and get it for a lot less.

Jim, how does one identify 'pure' pewter at a flea market?  I've got 
to try this.

-- 
Cheers --- Larry Marshall
Quebec City, QC 
http://www.woodnbits.com

On March 3, 2004 10:35 pm, you wrote:
> The pieces I have found were marked "Pewter" on the bottom.

This would be a good indicator :-)

>   Actually I have to admit that if it isn't marked, I don't know
> how to identify it.  My SWMBO can tell at a glance though, and I
> rely on her.

Ah...a pewter sniffer in the family.  My wife gets too bored with my 
rummaging through boxes of rust to go to flea markets with me :-)

-- 
Cheers --- Larry Marshall
Quebec City, QC 
http://www.woodnbits.com

 Me, I just went on ebay and searched for pewter. This brings up lots of 
small hobby casting outfits but the radiator rebuilders offered it alot 
cheaper. 
 It's all, like, 99% or more plain tin and some small additives like 
antimony, copper, etc. Different refiners use different recipes but the 
additives are so small I can't tell any difference. You could indeed use 
staybright or modern soft "silver" solder for plumbing, but the 
expense..........
   The cast metal shrinks a bit when it cools so I build up the edges of 
the groove with a couple layers of tape first. Then, I lay a piece of 
greased twine (clothesline) in the groove before covering it with the 
masking tape. Don't stick the tape ends together but leave a bit of 
space.  This is so you can pull the string out after you've built up at 
least a couple/three  layers of tape on top of the string. Lately I've 
been building up cones of tape and drywall mud to form a small funnel 
for a pour spout. This gives you a bit more metal weight over the mold 
to push out a few more air bubbles (hate those bubbles). I also punch 
(or actually drill with an awl so's I don't crush the paper mold) a 
small air hole near the pour spout when the mud dries. Then tip it over 
a bit when pouring so the metal can flow around hitting the breather 
hole last. When I see metal peeking up through the hole I know it's made 
it. 
 You want the metal pretty hot. Too cold and it won't flow well enough. 
I heat over a one burner propane camp stove (elegance, eh? 8^) for at 
least several minutes after it melts.   If it scorches a toothpick right 
quick you're probably there. Graphite is supposed to help the metal flow 
better (George had better suggestions for pouring lube, but I couldn't 
find any of the stuff) so I'll pop a little squirt of it from a door 
lock lubricator tube just before I pour. I'm not sure it helps, but it 
doesn't hurt.   Last thing you do before tipping the ladle is a quick 
skim of surface crud with a stick.
   I still haven't been able to get it to flow into fine detail 
crevices. Rings or anything large is pretty easy. But get it down small 
and there's always some trouble. Last thing I heard was to pre heat the 
handle (it's wood, so I figured maybe a couple hundred degrees tops) and 
I'm going to try that soon. I'll let you know.
 yours, Scott
-- 
Scott Grandstaff, Box 409, Happy Camp, CA 96039 Tools: 
http://users.snowcrest.net/kitty/scott/scotts/tools/tools.html 
PageWorks: http://www.snowcrest.net/kitty/hpages/

Hi Larry & All,

Larry asks how you identify junk pewter to melt down in the anteek
shops. Unfortunately, I can tell you more about pewter than you probably
want to know. Jim's answer was a very proper one - buy stuff that has
"Pewter" stamped on the bottom. If it does not have that marking, it's
quite possibly an older and more valuable piece that should be left for
a collector. One of the oddities about pewter is that if it has that
pewter marking, it isn't really (to many people) pewter; it's a
variation called Britannia Metal made in the 1900s vs. earlier than
that. But it will do fine for melt down purposes. Experts disagree to
some extent, but the most common thinking is that "real" pewter is a
mixture of tin and lead. Britannia metal has no lead; it has antimony
instead. Very much like the change made to solder a few years back when
the lead in it was replaced by antimony to avoid lead in the drinking
water from the solder on pipe joints. Instead of melting down old
"pewter", you can simply use solder - essentially the same thing but
maybe mixed to be a bit softer than the "pewter" was.

Best Wishes,
Bob 

Well, the question becomes, what is "pure?" Pewter has a lot of alloys
over the years, with most of the ones used for foodstuffs being low
lead, while some of the art alloys using quite a bit of lead as a =
"filler."=20
You might want to try a good scrap metal yard. They may have some known
alloy tin scrap. If I were making fish wackers I wouldn't care much =
about
the lead content, and would use any of the various alloys I have around =
for
bullet casting. If I were going to be handling it a lot, like for a =
brace,
I'd be more fussy.=20

Jim Foster
A link to some pewter info:
http://www.dmgovan.com/?page=3Dwhat_is

>=20
>=20
> The pieces I have found were marked "Pewter" on the bottom.
>=20
>   Actually I have to admit that if it isn't marked, I don't=20
> know how to=20
> identify it.  My SWMBO can tell at a glance though, and I rely on her.
>=20
> Maybe somebody else can answer this better.
>=20
> On Wednesday, March 3, 2004, at 07:14  PM, Larry Marshall wrote:
>=20
> >
> >> Scott has found a source for tin, which is what pewter actually
> >> is, at about $8 a pound. I keep an eye out for junk pewter at
> >> estate sales and fleas and get it for a lot less.
> >
> > Jim, how does one identify 'pure' pewter at a flea market?  I've got
> > to try this.
> >
> Jim Thompson, the old millrat in Riverside, CA
>=20
>=20
> Archive: http://www.frontier.iarc.uaf.edu/~cswingle/archive/
> To unsubscribe or change options, use the web interface:
>     http://galoots.law.cornell.edu:81/read/?forum=3Doldtools
>=20

> anteek shops. Unfortunately, I can tell you more about pewter
> than you probably want to know. 

This doesn't sound unfortunate from where I sit :-)

> Jim's answer was a very proper
> one - buy stuff that has "Pewter" stamped on the bottom. If it

I like 'easy'.  I'm best at mastering such skills.

> oddities about pewter is that if it has that pewter marking, it
> isn't really (to many people) pewter; it's a variation called
> Britannia Metal made in the 1900s vs. earlier than that. But it
> will do fine for melt down purposes. 

Interesting.

> Experts disagree to some
> extent, but the most common thinking is that "real" pewter is a
> mixture of tin and lead. Britannia metal has no lead; it has
> antimony instead. 

Ah...I'm not as dumb as I generally think I am.  Last night I went 
to the McMaster-Carr site that Richard mentioned and found 
"lead-free pewter".  That seemed counter to the definition of it 
that I knew.  Thanks for clarifying this.

> Instead of melting down old "pewter", you can simply use solder -
> essentially the same thing but maybe mixed to be a bit softer
> than the "pewter" was.

Well, shazaam....might be worth a try.

I feel edified.  Thanks.

-- 
Cheers --- Larry Marshall
Quebec City, QC 
http://www.woodnbits.com

I think I mentioned this before but - I used liquid solder=20
(from a tube).  It was for a brace with the pewter rings=20
missing.  The wood was wired on.  I tightened the wire and=20
started squeezing the liquid solder on.  I did it over a few=20
days, a layer at a time.  When I finally got it on a little=20
above the wood, I started working it down.  The only problem
I had, was the solder kinda blended into the wood.  I could
have taken care of that at the start but didn't. I used=20
lacquer thinner and it took care of most of it.

Jim =20

-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Marshall [mailto:larry@w...]=20
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 10:47 AM
To: oldtools
Subject: Re: [oldtools] Pewter rings

you can simply use solder -