Hi,

Time to delurk and reply to Todd's question, so here's a brief bio.

Long ago and far away, back in the dark ages (which were lots of fun), I
alternated among working as a carpenter and boatbuilder, waging
nonviolent revolution and communing with nature.  In order to delay the
onset of reality, I returned to school at the age of 26, acculumated a
pile of very interesting but mostly useless degrees based on studies
behavior genetics and evolution.  I now work as a psychiatric
epidemiologist (anybody got more syllables in their job title :)?).

During the hiaitus caused by my education and early professional life,
my tools mostly sat accumulating rust -- broken out only occasionally
for minor repairs and building bookshelves (lots of bookshelves!).

In the past couple of years, since a failing back took the joy out of
golf, I've been doing progressively more wood projects -- antique
furniture restorations, kitchen cabinets and 1000 sq' of deck.  In the
process, I've become progressively more interested in learning quality
jointery, traditional methods and protecting my ears and lungs.  In the
process, I'm learning that with sharp hand tools I can do many tasks
quicker and very nearly as accurately as with p*w*r "tools" -- not only
that, but my screwups are less frequent and easier to recover from.

My collection of old tools is limited but growing -- a type 13? #7, a
type 14 #5, misc. marking gauges and an oldish set of Buck Bros. socket
chisels.  More to come!

My SWMBO is another academic and very understanding -- she must think
that she'll get something out of all of this!

Now to Todd's question:

Todd Kissam wrote:
> Is there a way (easy hopefully) to tell american beech vs english
> beech.
> 
> Us early woodies would like to know so when we find an unknown maker
> we know which side of the atlantic to look for him on.
> 
> It can also mean serious $$$. The value of the american plane
> is 2 or 3 times that of an english.
> 
> Why? - I do not know - folks on Jeff's/Richard's side of the big
> pond spend too much on warm beer I guess :^)
> 
> Todd
> 

I just had the pleasure of spending a few days in Williamsburg, with
much of my time spent lurking around the carpenters' yard asking lots of
dumb questions (I know -- no such thing as a dumb question -- just dumb
questioners :)) about 18th century wood technology and tools.  One thing
that I was told was that by the late 18th century, most of the beech
harvested in Virginia was shipped to Britain for use by planemakers.  If
this is true, then identifying the origin of the wood would probably not
be informative with respect to the origin of the plane.  Can anyone
verify this story?

-- 
Frederick A. Marsteller, Ph.D.,         GMHI, Room 402W
1256 Briarcliff Rd., NE,                Atlanta, GA  30306
Phone: (404) 894-4343                   Fax: (404) 894-8502

"The health of nations is more important than the wealth of nations."
-- Will Durant

At 10:21 AM 1/17/97 -0500, Fred Marsteller wrote:
>
>I just had the pleasure of spending a few days in Williamsburg, with
>much of my time spent lurking around the carpenters' yard asking lots of
>dumb questions (I know -- no such thing as a dumb question -- just dumb
>questioners :)) about 18th century wood technology and tools.  One thing
>that I was told was that by the late 18th century, most of the beech
>harvested in Virginia was shipped to Britain for use by planemakers.  If
>this is true, then identifying the origin of the wood would probably not
>be informative with respect to the origin of the plane.  Can anyone
>verify this story?
>
Seems plausible as a lot of other species of woods made their way across the
pond.  I do remember reading someplace that the English planemakers did feel
that the American beech was an inferior wood to the English beech, that the
English product was denser.  Hard call from what I have seen, although
(warning, highly inflammable personal opinion approaching), in the planes
that I have handled many of the English planes do seem to have made it
through the ages  better than their American cousins of comparible age.

Now I realise that there are environmental factors at work here as well, but
also consider the fact that (and this is based on my readings to date and
maybe Jeff can shed some additional light on this), that the manufacture and
use of wooden planes in England went on far longer than it did in this
country.  (almost all the wooden plane makers were shut down by the early
1920's for the US of A vs. post WWII for England.)

Tony

   
___________________________________________________________________
	One is an interest
		Two is a collection
			Three is an obsession
___________________________________________________________________

Anthony Seo wrote:

~  Seems plausible as a lot of other species of woods made their way across the
~  pond.  I do remember reading someplace that the English planemakers did feel
~  that the American beech was an inferior wood to the English beech, that the
~  English product was denser.  Hard call from what I have seen, although
~  (warning, highly inflammable personal opinion approaching), in the planes
~  that I have handled many of the English planes do seem to have made it
~  through the ages  better than their American cousins of comparible age.

I'm no timber expert, but the English Beech I have bought has been
mostly white, with darker streaks and pretty hard to work. However, I
don't have much experience of it since I've mostly ordered Steamed
Beech which is pinkish in colour and often of continental origin.
Danish and Northern European said to be harder and denser than
Yugoslavian or Roumanian. It looks to me as though this is the
material from which most planes were made.

One reference GS Boulger (1902), gives American Beech, Fagus
ferruginea, as considered inferior to English Beech, Fagus sylvatica.
 
~  Now I realise that there are environmental factors at work here as well, but
~  also consider the fact that (and this is based on my readings to date and
~  maybe Jeff can shed some additional light on this), that the manufacture and
~  use of wooden planes in England went on far longer than it did in this
~  country.  (almost all the wooden plane makers were shut down by the early
~  1920's for the US of A vs. post WWII for England.)

When I went to college in 1945, my father bought me a new wooden jack
plane, and I recall wooden jacks being readily available for sale for
some years after that. I was given an English made Stanley #4
smoother. Some better-off chaps had steel jacks as well.

Jeff

-- 
Jeff Gorman - West Yorkshire
jeff@m...