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266517 Micah Salb <msalb@l...> 2018‑09‑16 Swapped Pins and Tails!
Whah!

I finished cutting my tails and did my saw cuts for one set of pins and I’m
staring at the boards saying, something’s not right here.

Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!

Ack.

So.  How can I continue this without redoing all my work but not have the bottom
fall out?  Wedge the pins?  Pin them?

Grrr!

Micah
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266518 Nichael Cramer <nichael@s...> 2018‑09‑16 Re: Swapped Pins and Tails!
At 05:43 PM 9/16/2018, Micah Salb wrote:
>Whah!
>
>I finished cutting my tails and did my saw cuts for one set of pins 
>and I'm staring at the boards saying, something's not right here.
>
>Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!
>
>Ack.
>
>So.  How can I continue this without redoing all my work but not 
>have the bottom fall out?  Wedge the pins?  Pin them?
>
>Grrr!

(Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt)

1] If you have sufficient slack in the length in the correct 
dimension, probably
the most foolproof thing would be to cut off the, um, 
"incorrectly-placed tails"
(and an appropriate length on the opposite board) and start again, ending up
with a slightly smaller- finished piece.

2] Option two, that I've tried in a similar situation:  cleanup the saw-cuts
and insert/glue skinny shim-like slips of wood into the kerfs.  If 
you do a careful
enough job and you get the grain oriented correction, it should look 
(reasonably) OK.

3] Less agreeable:  If you come up with a not-too-good-looking, but 
strong-enough solution,
always remember: Veneer is your friend.

Hope there's anything useful here.

N
266519 Don Schwartz <dks@t...> 2018‑09‑16 Re: Swapped Pins and Tails!
Cut them off and get out the board-stretcher!
Don

On 2018-09-16 4:18 PM, Nichael Cramer wrote:
> At 05:43 PM 9/16/2018, Micah Salb wrote:
>> Whah!
>>
>> I finished cutting my tails and did my saw cuts for one set of pins 
>> and I'm staring at the boards saying, something's not right here.
>>
>> Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!
>>
>> Ack.
>>
>> So.  How can I continue this without redoing all my work but not have 
>> the bottom fall out?  Wedge the pins?  Pin them?
>>
>> Grrr!
>
> (Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt)
>
> 1] If you have sufficient slack in the length in the correct 
> dimension, probably
> the most foolproof thing would be to cut off the, um, 
> "incorrectly-placed tails"
> (and an appropriate length on the opposite board) and start again, 
> ending up
> with a slightly smaller- finished piece.
>
> 2] Option two, that I've tried in a similar situation:  cleanup the 
> saw-cuts
> and insert/glue skinny shim-like slips of wood into the kerfs.  If you 
> do a careful
> enough job and you get the grain oriented correction, it should look 
> (reasonably) OK.
>
> 3] Less agreeable:  If you come up with a not-too-good-looking, but 
> strong-enough solution,
> always remember: Veneer is your friend.
>
> Hope there's anything useful here.
>
> N
>
>
>
>> Micah
>> Disclaimer: This email and any files transmitted with it contain 
>> confidential information and are intended only for the individual 
>> named. If you are not the intended recipient, you are notified that 
>> disclosing, copying, distributing, or taking any action in reliance 
>> on the contents of this information is strictly prohibited. If you 
>> have received this e-mail by mistake, please delete this e-mail from 
>> your system and notify the sender immediately by e-mail. Thank you.
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage,
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
>
> To change your subscription options:
> https://oldtools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
>
> To read the FAQ:
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>
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266520 Erik Levin 2018‑09‑17 Re: Swapped Pins and Tails!
Micah Salb wrote:
> Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!
Rather a thistle to the backside, no?
Having done similar, I have three related suggestions that allow the work so far
to continue:

Finish as-is, kerf at 45 degrees into the corner (catching, obviously, all pins
and tails), and insert a spline to lock the joint.
OrFinish as-is, drill through the whole set at each joint for a dowel, such as a
3mm (1/8") bamboo skewer, to lock it up
OrFinish as-is, and drill into the pin sides (if they are wide enough) to insert
dowels (the a fore-mentioned 3mmskewers, for example) to lock the joints.
My mailbox has taken 7 years with the last solution, despite the best effort of
weather and man to destroy it, for similar reasons (12mm poplar and 3mm skewers,
in this case)


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266522 "John M Johnston (jmjhnstn)" <jmjhnstn@m...> 2018‑09‑17 Re: Swapped Pins and Tails!
If this is a typical carcase, then it’s likely way over engineered. Given well
fitting joints and quality glue, I suspect the bottom will not fall out.

.02
John

“P.S. If you do not receive this, of course it must have been miscarried;
therefore I beg you to write and let me know.” - Sir Boyle Roche, M.P.

On Sep 16, 2018, at 5:43 PM, Micah Salb mailto:msalb@l...>> wrote:

Whah!

I finished cutting my tails and did my saw cuts for one set of pins and I’m
staring at the boards saying, something’s not right here.

Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!

Ack.

So.  How can I continue this without redoing all my work but not have the bottom
fall out?  Wedge the pins?  Pin them?
266525 "yorkshireman@y..." <yorkshireman@y...> 2018‑09‑17 Re: Swapped Pins and Tails!
Micah rotates his dovetails...

> On 16 Sep 2018, at 22:43, Micah Salb  wrote:
> 
> Whah!
> 
> I finished cutting my tails and did my saw cuts for one set of pins and I’m
staring at the boards saying, something’s not right here.
> 
> Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!


you don’t say what the piece is.  If It’s those ever-so-delicate dovetails in
the drawers of a writing slope then no one will notice, and it will be your
secret (Our’s now, too)

If It’s the base of a bookcase that will be abused by being double stacked (I
Know you legal types) then you need to make a judgement.

IS it mechanically sound anyway?
How visible is it?
Are other people going to walk in the room and instantly point and say “What
buffoon made THAT! go and demand a refund immediately”

If it’s likely to fall apart - which I’d say was doubtful, having seen your
standard of work, then as others suggested, drill from the unseen side, and add
a trenail.
A good glue, and a tight joint, will take a huge amount of abuse,  


Owning up is good for the (galoot) soul of course - noone else on the list has
‘ever’ done anything like that.  I k now I haven’t.  (except for…  - practice,
that’s it, Always a good idea to cut a practice joint first.


Richard Wilson
Yorkshireman Galoot
in Northumbria.
266526 "Ed O'" <edo@e...> 2018‑09‑17 Re: Swapped Pins and Tails!
A dovetail joint has 2 advantages over other joints in terms of potential
failure.  The first is the mechanical advantage of the wedging.  The second
is the increased glue surface are.  Sounds like you have lost the mechanical
advantage, but you still have the increased glue surface area working for
you.  

I have seen old dovetail chests with cut nails driven into the pins/tails as
kind of a belt and suspenders approach.  

These are expensive, but look pretty old school when used.

http://store.tremontnail.com/cgi-bin/tremontnail/items?mv_arg=16

I am local to them and have actually been to the factory (really a very
large shed).  It is very loud when the machinery is running.  I have
actually found boxes of the nails at the local ReStore (Habitat for
Humanity).  

Ed O'

-----Original Message-----

I finished cutting my tails and did my saw cuts for one set of pins and I'm
staring at the boards saying, something's not right here.

Then it dawned on me:  I put the tails on the wrong boards!

Ack.

Micah

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