OldTools Archive
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261680 | Ed Minch <ruby1638@a...> | 2017‑02‑16 | Octagon |
GGG I am working on some vanity legs that are turned from blank made of 8 pie pieces glued together. At its fattest, the leg is almost 3” across. My question - I have the wedge shaped pie pieces cut (with the help of electrickery) and now I have to glue them together. The 6” long sample that I cut demonstrates that this ain’t easy getting al the pieces to point towards the center so I am worried about the 28” lengths of the full legs. Does anyone have a glue-up trick? I am thinking hose clamps for clamping, but first have to get all the points in the same place. I have thought of gluing it half at a time, then the two halves, but no. To complicate things, there is a veneer piece between each wedge, so what a mess Something like this: https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/32096342704/in/dateposted-public/ Ed Minch |
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261681 | <gtgrouch@r...> | 2017‑02‑16 | Re: Octagon |
Is the veneer already cut so it is the same dimension as the pie slices? If so, I'd use black plastic tape wrapped four or five times around. Start in the middle, wrap once, then pull each wrap tighter until the tape breaks on the last wrap. Easier to do than it is to describe. Gary Katsanis Albion New York, USA ---- Ed Minch |
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261682 | Phil Schempf <philschempf@g...> | 2017‑02‑16 | Re: Octagon |
Ed- Not a lot of help here, but a couple of thoughts. When I'm clamping irregular shapes I use surgical rubber tubing, most often something about 1/4" in diameter. Start off with a few wraps in an open spiral, enough to hold things roughly in position and then get the pieces lined up the way you want them. Then add more wraps until it is squoze to the degree desired. The more wraps you add the greater the pressure. Squeeze out may glue bits of the tubing to your project, but they are easily scraped off and the worst aspect is the possible loss of the tubing for future projects, but it isn't too dear. Doesn't damage the project either, like a metal clamp may. This also seems like a project where another set of hands would be useful. If you have some one with a bit of handiness that you could draft, it may get things together before the glue sets. Speaking of which, I'd pick a glue with a longer open time to allow for fiddling. But not too much ;-). Phil |
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261683 | <gtgrouch@r...> | 2017‑02‑16 | Re: Octagon |
I forgot to mention: when the middle is wrapped, then do each end. The tape is stretchy and will pull very tight. YMMV, Gary K ---- gtgrouch@r... wrote: ============= Is the veneer already cut so it is the same dimension as the pie slices? If so, I'd use black plastic tape wrapped four or five times around. Start in the middle, wrap once, then pull each wrap tighter until the tape breaks on the last wrap. Easier to do than it is to describe. Gary Katsanis Albion New York, USA ---- Ed Minch |
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261684 | Nichael Cramer <nichael@s...> | 2017‑02‑16 | Re: Octagon |
Just to make sure: By "octagon" I assume you mean a tapered cylinder, initially consisting of 8 wedge-shaped slices (i.e. the outer surface is round, not with 8-sided flats) Correct? Maybe spending time on some kind of jig might help. For an "external" jig a "tapered trough" into which the leg-wedges could lie during glue-up would be ideal --but a huge amount of work to get it right. So maybe a number of rings (say an inch tall) to place along the length of the leg might work better. Or maybe an "internal jig". That is, assuming the leg-wedges are "pointy" on the inside (that is, the inner-most edges are all attempting to come together at a single point) perhaps it might be helpful to shave the "pointy" end off of each wedge, and form an interior octagon Then there could be octagonal shaped core piece, which could either serve as removable "jig". Or the wedges could then be individually glued to the new octagonal center piece and the complete leg built up in this way. I'm thinking maybe gluing it up in steps might be helpful as well, That is, hold all 8 pieces together, but initially only glue each pair of neighboring pieces together forming four pieces. Then glue each resulting quarter into halves, and then finally the whole leg. But in any case I'm betting however you do it, getting it perfect "the first time" is going to be darn near impossible. So if I were doing it I would count on there being some final cleanup/trim to bring it all true at the end. Anyway, just thinking out loud. And, as others have said, it would be easier to draw tthis han explain. In any case, hope there's anything useful here. N Ed Minch wrote: |
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261804 | Thomas Conroy | 2017‑02‑16 | Re: Octagon |
Ed Minch wrote: "I am working on some vanity legs that are turned from blank made of 8 pie pieces glued together.... I have the wedge shaped pie pieces cut (with the help of electrickery) and now I have to glue them together. The 6? long sample that I cut demonstrates that this ain?t easy getting al the pieces to point towards the center so I am worried about the 28? lengths of the full legs. Does anyone have a glue-up trick?" Do all the wedge-shaped pieces have to meet perfectly at the center? The meeting point will be well buried in the solid center of the leg, won't it? What matters for appearance is the permeter. I think you could be quite a way off and still present a respectable appearance. Tom Cpnroy |
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261686 | Thomas Conroy | 2017‑02‑16 | Re: Octagon |
Ed Minch wrote: "I am working on some vanity legs that are turned from blank made of 8 pie pieces glued together.... I have the wedge shaped pie pieces cut (with the help of electrickery) and now I have to glue them together. The 6? long sample that I cut demonstrates that this ain?t easy getting al the pieces to point towards the center so I am worried about the 28? lengths of the full legs. Does anyone have a glue-up trick?" Do all the wedge-shaped pieces have to meet perfectly at the center? The meeting point will be well buried in the solid center of the leg, won't it? What matters for appearance is the permeter. I think you could be quite a way off and still present a respectable appearance. Tom Cpnroy |
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261688 | "David & AnnTardiff" <tardiff13@v...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
If you can plan ahead, knowing where it will be turned down.... Use some small brads, drive through the veneer and then clip them off, leaving just an eighth proud. These will prevent sliding while clamping with straps, ropes, tape, whatever.... -----Original Message----- From: Ed Minch Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2017 3:16 PM To: old tools new server Subject: [OldTools] Octagon GGG I am working on some vanity legs that are turned from blank made of 8 pie pieces glued together. At its fattest, the leg is almost 3” across. My question - I have the wedge shaped pie pieces cut (with the help of electrickery) and now I have to glue them together. The 6” long sample that I cut demonstrates that this ain’t easy getting al the pieces to point towards the center so I am worried about the 28” lengths of the full legs. Does anyone have a glue-up trick? I am thinking hose clamps for clamping, but first have to get all the points in the same place. I have thought of gluing it half at a time, then the two halves, but no. To complicate things, there is a veneer piece between each wedge, so what a mess Something like this: https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/32096342704/in/dateposted-public/ Ed Minch ------------------------------------------------------------------------ OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage, value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools. To change your subscription options: https://oldtools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools To read the FAQ: https://swingleydev.com/archive/faq.html OldTools archive: https://swingleydev.com/ot/ OldTools@s... David & Ann Tardiff |
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261689 | Peter Marquis-Kyle <peter@m...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
Would it help if you put a small dowel in the center (centre, Jeff) of the assembly? You would need to rip a small strip off the pointy edge of each pie slice (equal to the radius of the dowel). The dowel might make it easier to get all the pieces into place before you apply the rubber bands or hose clamps. Disclaimer: I've never done this, so apply the appropriate discount to the purchase price for this advice... -- Peter Marquis-Kyle www.marquis-kyle.com.au |
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261691 | Ed Minch <ruby1638@a...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
All Thanks for the myriad ideas. I cut my sample from a scrap of 2 X 4 and the resultant piece is 2-7/8” across - about the right size for my final piece. https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/32819574531/in/dateposted-public/ The pieces are just inconsistent enough in size that you can see that when the outside surfaces are lined up, the centers don’t meet. The three things that seem to make the most sense are 1) make them as consistent as possible, 2) cut the points off and put a small (1/4”?) dowel up the middle so they want to only go in so far, and 2) Tom Conroys sage advice: |
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261692 | Bill Webber <ol2lrus@v...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
The picture you show doesn't show the veneer edge. Also, does it matter if the center lines up? This looks like one of those dilemmas I often get into where the worry is more trouble than the actual solution. I'm thinking it is the outside that is important. I would do as some suggested and do a dry run without glue, testing surgical hose or stretchy masking tape as a clamp around and around the whole assembly. Cut off the points if they interfere with the outside alignment. You can always smooth out small dis-alignment after the glue dries and no one would ever know the difference. Gluing up a half section makes sense at some level but practically it is difficult with the kind of clamps we use most. I doubt my comments are particularly helpful, but it's easy to throw in a comment on someone else's problem. :-) Bill W. In Beautiful downtown Nottingham, PA |
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261693 | Chuck Taylor | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
Ed, Seems to me that it might be easier to glue it up "in the square", then trim it to an octagon. Woodturners generally do their glue-ups first, then turn the result round. Chuck Taylor north of Seattle |
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261694 | Kirk Eppler <eppler.kirk@g...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
On Thu, Feb 16, 2017 at 6:57 PM, Chuck Taylor via OldTools < oldtools@s...> wrote: > > Seems to me that it might be easier to glue it up "in the square", then > trim it to an octagon. Woodturners generally do their glue-ups first, then > turn the result round. Never done this, but what about making a square jig of known dimensions for the ends, and slide the pieces in, then jam them outward til they hit the walls. If sized correctly, it seems like they'd have to be true. -- Kirk Eppler in Half Moon Bay, CA, but not really |
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261696 | "Frank Filippone" <red735il@g...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
There is a router bit called a birds' beak????? That allows for a locking M+T in each piece.. think floorboards in the round..... See this for the idea...... http://www.rockler.com/how-to/specialized-router-bits-birds-mouth-multi-angl e-bits-easy-bird-house-building/ Now all you need is a human powered router...... But truly, would this not be easier as a turning? Glue it up in the "square" turn it round....?????? Frank Filippone Red735il@g... |
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261697 | Don Schwartz <dks@t...> | 2017‑02‑17 | Re: Octagon |
On 2017-02-16 1:16 PM, Ed Minch wrote: > GGG > > I am working on some vanity legs that are turned from blank made of 8 pie pieces glued together. At its fattest, the leg is almost 3” across. > > My question - I have the wedge shaped pie pieces cut (with the help of electrickery) and now I have to glue them together. The 6” long sample that I cut demonstrates that this ain’t easy getting al the pieces to point towards the center so I am worried about the 28” lengths of the full legs. Does anyone have a glue-up trick? I am thinking hose clamps for clamping, but first have to get all the points in the same place. I have thought of gluing it half at a time, then the two halves, but no. > > To complicate things, there is a veneer piece between each wedge, so what a mess > > Something like this: > > https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/32096342704/in/dateposted-public/ > > Ed Minch > Never done this - and wouldn't, likely. Doing the glue-up all at once is likely to be a PITA, even with the masking tape roll-up trick and surgical tubing. I count 8 pieces + 8 veneers with 2 surfaces each = way too many glue surfaces to be brought together all at once. Life is too short. Open time too. A more reasonable approach would have been to glue up 4 square rods with veneer between, then cut on the diagonals, insert veneers, and reglue. BUT you can still proceed as though you'd done that, more or less. Glue up adjacent pairs with veneers between, making square rods. Then proceed more or less as above ... without panic. FWIW Don |
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