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Recent Bios FAQ

253299 "james duprie" <j.duprie@c...> 2015‑01‑29 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
The part I'm having a hard time with isn't getting the Large Very Heavy
Thing (about 1500 lbs) up on rollers. That's easy with a 10' steel pry bar
and a brick as a fulcrum. The hard part is how to get it up the ramp and
into the truck without an anchor point in the truck ( a winch or come along
would be easy if there was an anchor)...

The current concept is to walk it up the ramp using the 10' pry bar
(actually a digger bar, if you know what that is) about 6-12", wedge, reset
lever, and repeat.

On a side note - the rollers I use are about 2-3" Can't recall exactly)
dowels - probably oak - that I turned about 10 years ago. At that point, my
daughter was 5, and she was thrilled that she could push the Large Very
Heavy Thing across the shop by herself.....

-James

-----Original Message-----
From: OldTools [mailto:oldtools-
bounces@s...] On Behalf Of Ed
Minch
Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2015 8:22 AM
To: Christopher Swingley
Cc: OldTools List
Subject: Re: [OldTools] Lifting heavy things

7, 2015, at 10:47 PM, Christopher Swingley  wrote:

> 
> Scott's mention of jacks and cranes and blocking earlier today 
> reminded me of one of last summer's projects.  It involves old tools 
> and wood, but not of a sort we traditionally discuss in this forum.


Chris

Well done - and how common is a 50 foot straight log in your area?  They are
pieces of wood that not only will warm you twice, but now have the potential
to warm you a few more ties before it is all over.

I showed this set of pictures about 2 years ago, but here it is again:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/14097256262/in/set-7215764408779
4668/">https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/14097256262/in/set-721576440877946
68/

My brother lives on the Esopus Creek about 200 yards from the Hudson River
below Albany.  The house is about as close to the creek as Chris' is, and
was built in the 30's.  In 1955 there was an epic flood where the house had
a couple of inches of water in it, so it was raised 2 cinder blocks higher,
16".

In 2011 there was a lot - a lot - of rain in the area.  In fact if you watch
some of CHris' videos, at the end some videos of that flood come up - Irene
by name.  The creek came up and put 2" of water in the house, so he and his
wife had to move out and fix things up.  He devised a method where he cut
the interior drywall at about 30" off the floor, cut out the wall
insulation, and installed a chair rail and a baseboards with grooves at the
back and a removable piece as a wainscotting.  He changed some wiring to be
flood proof, re-insulated, and finished things off and moved back in.  Since
Irene was the 100 year flood he figured he was OK for a while.

Sandy hit the area a year later.  The water rose 13 feet in New York City
and actually filled a couple of tunnels under the East River - yow.  His
house is 80 miles up the river and they got 7 feet of that 13.  The water
was 22" up the walls of his freshly re-freshed house.  During Irene, the
water came from upstream, but in Sandy it came from downstream.  Sandy was
something like 34" higher than the epic 1955 flood!!

Again he moved out and in the spring raised the house.  He has a good friend
who is in the Timber Framer's Guild and he works mostly on mill restoration,
but I also watched him replace one rotted member of a truss in a big old
stone barn without taking the truss apart.  I also had a fun day numbering
and disassembling a 1740 Dutch barn with him and his crew.

He came with his 15 screw jacks and a truck load of timbers, and 4 of us
spent the day lifting the house 28".  It was - lift and inch on this row of
5, lift an inch on that row of 5 and back and forth under the house all day.
All the time wrestling big timbers to set the house on.  Pretty interesting
day.

Our sailboat was a few miles away out of the water for the season on the
Roundout Creek in Kingston and the water came up high enough that smaller
boats were floating out into the road, but we need 6 feet of water to float
so we were OK.  I included some pictures showing how easy it is to handle 12
tons with the right equipment.  They have these machines that can handle a
couple of hundred tons.

OT content - check those screw jacks.

Ed Minch
253300 JAMES THOMPSON <oldmillrat@m...> 2015‑01‑30 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
I brought home a safe weighing 1200 pounds, and almost 6’ tall. I had no other
method, so I lifted one corner at a time about an inch, then put blocks of
varying thicknesses under the corners until I had enough room for cribbing. Then
I repeated the process, over and over until I got it up the the height of my
truck bed. Then I removed just enough cribbing to get the tail gate under it.
After that it was easy.

Arriving home, I got some help and laid the safe on its side, then we scooted it
off until one bottom edge was on my concrete driveway. Now, how to stand it up?

I drilled a hole in my driveway and inserted an eye bolt. Used a come-along to
tilt it up straight. Then used a big pry bar to inch it into my garage.  Where
it lives unto this very day. And I do not think it is ever going to leave.


On Jan 29, 2015, at 3:48 PM, james duprie  wrote:

> The part I'm having a hard time with isn't getting the Large Very Heavy
> Thing (about 1500 lbs) up on rollers. That's easy with a 10' steel pry bar
> and a brick as a fulcrum. The hard part is how to get it up the ramp and
> into the truck without an anchor point in the truck ( a winch or come along
> would be easy if there was an anchor)...
> 
> The current concept is to walk it up the ramp using the 10' pry bar
> (actually a digger bar, if you know what that is) about 6-12", wedge, reset
> lever, and repeat.
> 
> On a side note - the rollers I use are about 2-3" Can't recall exactly)
> dowels - probably oak - that I turned about 10 years ago. At that point, my
> daughter was 5, and she was thrilled that she could push the Large Very
> Heavy Thing across the shop by herself.....
> 
> -James
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: OldTools [mailto:oldtools-
bounces@s...] On Behalf Of Ed
> Minch
> Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2015 8:22 AM
> To: Christopher Swingley
> Cc: OldTools List
> Subject: Re: [OldTools] Lifting heavy things
> 
> 7, 2015, at 10:47 PM, Christopher Swingley  wrote:
> 
>> 
>> Scott's mention of jacks and cranes and blocking earlier today 
>> reminded me of one of last summer's projects.  It involves old tools 
>> and wood, but not of a sort we traditionally discuss in this forum.
> 
> 
> Chris
> 
> Well done - and how common is a 50 foot straight log in your area?  They are
> pieces of wood that not only will warm you twice, but now have the potential
> to warm you a few more ties before it is all over.
> 
> I showed this set of pictures about 2 years ago, but here it is again:
> 
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/14097256262/in/set-72157644087
794668/">https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/14097256262/in/set-7215764408779
4668/
> 
> My brother lives on the Esopus Creek about 200 yards from the Hudson River
> below Albany.  The house is about as close to the creek as Chris' is, and
> was built in the 30's.  In 1955 there was an epic flood where the house had
> a couple of inches of water in it, so it was raised 2 cinder blocks higher,
> 16".
> 
> In 2011 there was a lot - a lot - of rain in the area.  In fact if you watch
> some of CHris' videos, at the end some videos of that flood come up - Irene
> by name.  The creek came up and put 2" of water in the house, so he and his
> wife had to move out and fix things up.  He devised a method where he cut
> the interior drywall at about 30" off the floor, cut out the wall
> insulation, and installed a chair rail and a baseboards with grooves at the
> back and a removable piece as a wainscotting.  He changed some wiring to be
> flood proof, re-insulated, and finished things off and moved back in.  Since
> Irene was the 100 year flood he figured he was OK for a while.
> 
> Sandy hit the area a year later.  The water rose 13 feet in New York City
> and actually filled a couple of tunnels under the East River - yow.  His
> house is 80 miles up the river and they got 7 feet of that 13.  The water
> was 22" up the walls of his freshly re-freshed house.  During Irene, the
> water came from upstream, but in Sandy it came from downstream.  Sandy was
> something like 34" higher than the epic 1955 flood!!
> 
> Again he moved out and in the spring raised the house.  He has a good friend
> who is in the Timber Framer's Guild and he works mostly on mill restoration,
> but I also watched him replace one rotted member of a truss in a big old
> stone barn without taking the truss apart.  I also had a fun day numbering
> and disassembling a 1740 Dutch barn with him and his crew.
> 
> He came with his 15 screw jacks and a truck load of timbers, and 4 of us
> spent the day lifting the house 28".  It was - lift and inch on this row of
> 5, lift an inch on that row of 5 and back and forth under the house all day.
> All the time wrestling big timbers to set the house on.  Pretty interesting
> day.
> 
> Our sailboat was a few miles away out of the water for the season on the
> Roundout Creek in Kingston and the water came up high enough that smaller
> boats were floating out into the road, but we need 6 feet of water to float
> so we were OK.  I included some pictures showing how easy it is to handle 12
> tons with the right equipment.  They have these machines that can handle a
> couple of hundred tons.
> 
> OT content - check those screw jacks.
> 
> Ed Minch
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage,
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
> 
> To change your subscription options:
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
> 
> To read the FAQ:
> http://swingleydev.com/archi
ve/faq.html
> 
> OldTools archive: http://swingleydev.com/archive/">http://swingleydev.com/archive/
> 
> OldTools@s...
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage,
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
> 
> To change your subscription options:
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
> 
> To read the FAQ:
> http://swingleydev.com/archi
ve/faq.html
> 
> OldTools archive: http://swingleydev.com/ot/">http://swingleydev.com/ot/
> 
> OldTools@s...
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
253302 Christopher Swingley <cswingle@s...> 2015‑01‑30 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
James,

On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:48 PM, james duprie  wrote:
> The hard part is how to get it up the ramp and
> into the truck without an anchor point in the truck ( a winch or come along
> would be easy if there was an anchor)...

Is there a way you could park the truck facing something that could be
used as an anchor point for a rope such that the center point of the
rope would be at the front of the bed of the truck (nearest the cab),
and that rope could be the anchor point for a winch?  For example,
park the truck such that there's a tree ahead and to the left and
right of the front of the truck.  Tie a rope to one tree, extend it
back around the cab and then tie to the other tree.  Hook the winch to
the middle of the rope and pull.

Pretending we're using the Internet of the 90s (fixed width font
required).  O's represent the fixed objects, W is the winch.

O               O
 \             /
  \ +-------+ /
   \| TRUCK |/
    \-------/
    |\     /|
    | +-+-+ |
    |   W   |
    |   |   |
    |   |   |
    |   |   |
    +---|---+
        |
        |
      HEAVY
      LOAD

Cheers,

Chris
-- 
Christopher Swingley
Fairbanks, Alaska
http://swingleydev.com/
cswingle@s...
253313 "james duprie" <j.duprie@c...> 2015‑01‑30 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
I actually thought about doing this - not with trees, but with stakes in the
ground (there aren't any trees. I guess I could use the bumper of a car if cars
still had bumpers...).
Anyway, I figured the chance of a stake failing, or the extra geometry involved
(as it would be 'pulling' from ground level) as I approached the roughly 4' bed
might be problematic....

We're still a couple of year away, and there is always the chance that I'll just
pay someone to move it for me (one of the advantages of being old enough to be
able to budget a bit....)

-J

-----Original Message-----
From: cswingle@g... [mailto:cswingle@g...]
On Behalf Of Christopher Swingley
Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2015 7:32 PM
To: james duprie
Cc: OldTools List
Subject: Re: [OldTools] Lifting heavy things - clarification

James,

On Thu, Jan 29, 2015 at 2:48 PM, james duprie  wrote:
> The hard part is how to get it up the ramp and into the truck without 
> an anchor point in the truck ( a winch or come along would be easy if 
> there was an anchor)...

Is there a way you could park the truck facing something that could be used as
an anchor point for a rope such that the center point of the rope would be at
the front of the bed of the truck (nearest the cab), and that rope could be the
anchor point for a winch?  For example, park the truck such that there's a tree
ahead and to the left and right of the front of the truck.  Tie a rope to one
tree, extend it back around the cab and then tie to the other tree.  Hook the
winch to the middle of the rope and pull.

Pretending we're using the Internet of the 90s (fixed width font required).  O's
represent the fixed objects, W is the winch.

O               O
 \             /
  \ +-------+ /
   \| TRUCK |/
    \-------/
    |\     /|
    | +-+-+ |
    |   W   |
    |   |   |
    |   |   |
    |   |   |
    +---|---+
        |
        |
      HEAVY
      LOAD

Cheers,

Chris
--
Christopher Swingley
Fairbanks, Alaska
http://swingleydev.com/
cswingle@s...
253314 "james duprie" <j.duprie@c...> 2015‑01‑30 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
I thought about this too, but is seems like it would be easier and safer to
walk it up the low-slope ramp. Less chance of it falling, id if it does get
free of a wedge, it would only roll back about 3-4' before it rolled off the
rollers. The ramp is wide enough that there isn't much concern about it
going over the side, so the only real concern is it getting away....

I have moved heavy things up ramps like this before, just never something
this heavy. The trick is the wedges. By making sure you've got a wedge under
each of the runners of the pallet (tapped in a with a mallet before the
lever is relaxed). Then, the lever is slowly relaxed - that way if there is
slippage you can catch it before it gets too far. High friction tape/paint
on the ramp or bottom of the wedges helps.

If you can get 3 people with levers, it's even easier, and you don't need
the wedges. You just take turns walking it up... In this case, the real
worry is lack of safety - if everyone slips, it will go until its off the
rollers....

-J

-----Original Message-----
From: JAMES THOMPSON [mailto:oldmillrat@m...]">mailto:oldmillrat@m...]
Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2015 7:27 PM
To: james duprie
Cc: OldTools List
Subject: Re: [OldTools] Lifting heavy things - clarification

I brought home a safe weighing 1200 pounds, and almost 6' tall. I had no
other method, so I lifted one corner at a time about an inch, then put
blocks of varying thicknesses under the corners until I had enough room for
cribbing. Then I repeated the process, over and over until I got it up the
the height of my truck bed. Then I removed just enough cribbing to get the
tail gate under it. After that it was easy.

Arriving home, I got some help and laid the safe on its side, then we
scooted it off until one bottom edge was on my concrete driveway. Now, how
to stand it up?

I drilled a hole in my driveway and inserted an eye bolt. Used a come-along
to tilt it up straight. Then used a big pry bar to inch it into my garage.
Where it lives unto this very day. And I do not think it is ever going to
leave.


On Jan 29, 2015, at 3:48 PM, james duprie  wrote:

> The part I'm having a hard time with isn't getting the Large Very 
> Heavy Thing (about 1500 lbs) up on rollers. That's easy with a 10' 
> steel pry bar and a brick as a fulcrum. The hard part is how to get it 
> up the ramp and into the truck without an anchor point in the truck ( 
> a winch or come along would be easy if there was an anchor)...
> 
> The current concept is to walk it up the ramp using the 10' pry bar 
> (actually a digger bar, if you know what that is) about 6-12", wedge, 
> reset lever, and repeat.
> 
> On a side note - the rollers I use are about 2-3" Can't recall 
> exactly) dowels - probably oak - that I turned about 10 years ago. At 
> that point, my daughter was 5, and she was thrilled that she could 
> push the Large Very Heavy Thing across the shop by herself.....
> 
> -James
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: OldTools [mailto:oldtools-
bounces@s...] On Behalf Of
> Ed Minch
> Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2015 8:22 AM
> To: Christopher Swingley
> Cc: OldTools List
> Subject: Re: [OldTools] Lifting heavy things
> 
> 7, 2015, at 10:47 PM, Christopher Swingley 
wrote:
> 
>> 
>> Scott's mention of jacks and cranes and blocking earlier today 
>> reminded me of one of last summer's projects.  It involves old tools 
>> and wood, but not of a sort we traditionally discuss in this forum.
> 
> 
> Chris
> 
> Well done - and how common is a 50 foot straight log in your area?  
> They are pieces of wood that not only will warm you twice, but now 
> have the potential to warm you a few more ties before it is all over.
> 
> I showed this set of pictures about 2 years ago, but here it is again:
> 
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/14097256262/in/set-72157644087
7">https://www.flickr.com/photos/ruby1638/14097256262/in/set-721576440877
> 94668/
> 
> My brother lives on the Esopus Creek about 200 yards from the Hudson 
> River below Albany.  The house is about as close to the creek as 
> Chris' is, and was built in the 30's.  In 1955 there was an epic flood 
> where the house had a couple of inches of water in it, so it was 
> raised 2 cinder blocks higher, 16".
> 
> In 2011 there was a lot - a lot - of rain in the area.  In fact if you 
> watch some of CHris' videos, at the end some videos of that flood come 
> up - Irene by name.  The creek came up and put 2" of water in the 
> house, so he and his wife had to move out and fix things up.  He 
> devised a method where he cut the interior drywall at about 30" off 
> the floor, cut out the wall insulation, and installed a chair rail and 
> a baseboards with grooves at the back and a removable piece as a 
> wainscotting.  He changed some wiring to be flood proof, re-insulated, 
> and finished things off and moved back in.  Since Irene was the 100 year
flood he figured he was OK for a while.
> 
> Sandy hit the area a year later.  The water rose 13 feet in New York 
> City and actually filled a couple of tunnels under the East River - 
> yow.  His house is 80 miles up the river and they got 7 feet of that 
> 13.  The water was 22" up the walls of his freshly re-freshed house.  
> During Irene, the water came from upstream, but in Sandy it came from 
> downstream.  Sandy was something like 34" higher than the epic 1955
flood!!
> 
> Again he moved out and in the spring raised the house.  He has a good 
> friend who is in the Timber Framer's Guild and he works mostly on mill 
> restoration, but I also watched him replace one rotted member of a 
> truss in a big old stone barn without taking the truss apart.  I also 
> had a fun day numbering and disassembling a 1740 Dutch barn with him and
his crew.
> 
> He came with his 15 screw jacks and a truck load of timbers, and 4 of 
> us spent the day lifting the house 28".  It was - lift and inch on 
> this row of 5, lift an inch on that row of 5 and back and forth under the
house all day.
> All the time wrestling big timbers to set the house on.  Pretty 
> interesting day.
> 
> Our sailboat was a few miles away out of the water for the season on 
> the Roundout Creek in Kingston and the water came up high enough that 
> smaller boats were floating out into the road, but we need 6 feet of 
> water to float so we were OK.  I included some pictures showing how 
> easy it is to handle 12 tons with the right equipment.  They have 
> these machines that can handle a couple of hundred tons.
> 
> OT content - check those screw jacks.
> 
> Ed Minch
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -- OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool 
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage, 
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of 
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
> 
> To change your subscription options:
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
> 
> To read the FAQ:
> http://swingleydev.com/archi
ve/faq.html
> 
> OldTools archive: http://swingleydev.com/archive/">http://swingleydev.com/archive/
> 
> OldTools@s...
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -- OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool 
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage, 
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of 
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
> 
> To change your subscription options:
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
> 
> To read the FAQ:
> http://swingleydev.com/archi
ve/faq.html
> 
> OldTools archive: http://swingleydev.com/ot/">http://swingleydev.com/ot/
> 
> OldTools@s...
> http://old
tools.swingleydev.com/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
253328 <ecoyle@t...> 2015‑01‑31 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
Have you considered a tow truck....moved a way too heavy metal lathe that way
once. Only a KM or three Driver actually liked the challenge.

Eric
253330 Ed Minch <ruby@m...> 2015‑01‑31 Re: Lifting heavy things - clarification
We had to move a freshly cast 8300 pound keel for a sailboat and used one of
those trucks that carries septic tanks.  A beam with a trolley about 6-7 feet
above the bed and extending out the back.

http://www.moldsofbethlehem
.com/trucks.htm

Two of us had to sit on the front bumper to keep the front of the truck on the
ground while it started the lift.
  
Ed Minch




On Jan 31, 2015, at 12:19 AM,   wrote:

> Have you considered a tow truck....moved a way too heavy metal lathe that way
once. Only a KM or three Driver actually liked the challenge.
> 
> Eric

Recent Bios FAQ