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250367 Steve Jones <stjones@k...> 2014‑09‑12 Round pencils
GGs;

If you are the other galoot who prefers round wooden pencils to the
hexagonal variety and have trouble finding them, I just got six from these
folks: http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/">http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/ (I
also like their notebooks but do
not advise leaving a red-covered one in your pants pocket when it goes into
the washing machine). Lee Valley used to carry round #2 pencils but don't
any more. They're a little spendy, but I figure I have a good five-year
supply, so the amortization works out OK.

-- 
Steve in Kokomo
250369 "Chuck Taylor" <cft98208@g...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Steve in Kokomo wrote that he 

> prefers round wooden pencils to the
> hexagonal variety and [has] trouble finding them

The Galootish thing to do would be to just buy the hexagonal ones and turn them
round using a pole lathe. Or pound them through a dowelling jig. Or what about a
Stanley #77 doweling machine?

Cheers,
Chuck Taylor
grinning, ducking, and running north of Seattle
250371 CheekyGeek <cheekygeek@g...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
That's hilarious, Chuck.

As some of you probably know the Holy Grail of pencils was the Eberhard
Faber Blackwing 602. They are round, not hexagonal. You have a chance to
get a box of 8 on eBay right now, if you like:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-BLACKWING-602-VINTAGE-EBERHARD-FABER-PENCILS-
WITH-ORIGINAL-BOX-/331315141490">http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-BLACKWING-602
-VINTAGE-EBERHARD-FABER-PENCILS-WITH-ORIGINAL-BOX-/331315141490

They routinely bring $40-50 each.

Well recently a company called Palomino is trading on the name:
http://www.amazon.com/Palomino-Blackwing-
Pencils-12-Count/dp/B006CQWILK">http://www.amazon.com/Palomino-Blackwing-
Pencils-12-Count/dp/B006CQWILK
They get good reviews, but it is not clear to me if they are really the
same formulation, but I think I'm going to give them a try. I recall my
dad, who was an assistant manager at a Safeway store (before they closed
down the whole central U.S. division) bringing home pencils that (I seem to
recall were branded IBM) and they were, I believe Eberhard Faber Dark Wing
602s. Writing or sketching with them was BLISS, not like the hard graphite
crap in pencils today.

Just wondering if anyone else remembers these wonderful old tools.

Darren Addy
Kearney, Nebraska



A man understands one day that his life is built on nothing, and that's a
bad, crazy day. - Cosmo Castorini, Moonstruck

On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 7:15 PM, Chuck Taylor  wrote:

> Steve in Kokomo wrote that he
>
> > prefers round wooden pencils to the
> > hexagonal variety and [has] trouble finding them
>
> The Galootish thing to do would be to just buy the hexagonal ones and turn
> them round using a pole lathe. Or pound them through a dowelling jig. Or
> what about a Stanley #77 doweling machine?
>
> Cheers,
> Chuck Taylor
> grinning, ducking, and running north of Seattle
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage,
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
>
> To change your subscription options:
> http://rucku
s.law.cornell.edu/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
>
> To read the FAQ:
> http://swingleydev.com/archi
ve/faq.html
>
> OldTools archive: http://swingleydev.com/archive/">http://swingleydev.com/archive/
>
> OldTools@r...
> http://rucku
s.law.cornell.edu/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
>
250372 Steve Jones <stjones@k...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Two reasons - (1) I hadn't really thought about it, but I think round is
more comfortable because it feels bigger in my big hands - maybe the flats
on a hexagon reduce the effective diameter. (2) I have a few Wm. Johnson
loose-leg wing dividers and it just seems that a round pencil fits better
when I use one as a compass.

Haven't tried the carpenter's pencils - I just grab something from the borg
because I don't use them very often. For joinery, I use a knife or a .3mm
mechanical pencil with a 2H or HB lead.

Steve in Kokomo

On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 6:07 PM, Daniel Miller 
wrote:

> Curious, why round?
>
> Any idea how their carpenter’s pencils are? I gave up on any available
> locally and order directly from Dixon (medium and hard).
>
> Dan
> ______________________
> Daniel Miller
> Editor, Wooden Canoe
> WCHA Webmaster
>
> Editorial Offices
> 7264 Beadles Point Road
> Cape Vincent, NY 13618
> 315-777-7007
> dan@d...
> www.WCHA.org
>
250375 Gary Roberts <toolemera@m...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Here is what I do:

In a V shaped jig, place the hexagonal pencil lengthwise. With a low angle block
plane, ground to 31 degrees, begin relieving each arris, working your way around
the pencil. As you consecutively relieve the arris produced by each pass of the
plane, you will notice that the arris’ will increase in number, but increase in
the degree at which they meet. When you have completed this process, the final
arris of each joining will be undetectable to the touch.

Best of luck!
Gary
...............................
Gary Roberts
http://toolemera.com
http://toolemerabooks.com

"I'ld rather read a good book, than write a poor one." Christopher Morley




On Sep 12, 2014, at 9:28 AM, Steve Jones  wrote:

> GGs;
> 
> If you are the other galoot who prefers round wooden pencils to the
> hexagonal variety and have trouble finding them, I just got six from these
> folks: http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/">http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/ (I
also like their notebooks but do
> not advise leaving a red-covered one in your pants pocket when it goes into
> the washing machine). Lee Valley used to carry round #2 pencils but don't
> any more. They're a little spendy, but I figure I have a good five-year
> supply, so the amortization works out OK.
> 
> -- 
> Steve in Kokomo
250378 Darrell & Kathy <larchmont@s...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Steve is Jonesing for some pencils:

> If you are the other galoot who  prefers round wooden pencils to the
 > hexagonal variety and have trouble finding them, I just got six from
 > these folks: http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/">http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/

I got these last year at one of the Tool Group meetings.
Cheaper than new, and I really like those fat old sketching pencils.
Plus the advertising is cool.

http://galootcentral.com/components/cpgalbums/userpics/10074/pencils.jp
g">http://galootcentral.com/components/cpgalbums/userpics/10074/pencils.jpg

And a few years back I got this odd kit at a yard sale in Verona ON.
It shows some of the steps in manufacturing a pencil.
I suspect some bits are missing, but it was cool enough to
entice me into buying it.

http://galootcentral.com/components/cpgalbums/userpics/10074/pencil_kit
.jpg">http://galootcentral.com/components/cpgalbums/userpics/10074/pencil_kit.jp
g

-- 
Darrell LaRue
Oakville ON
Wood Hoarder, Blade Sharpener, and Occasional Tool User
250379 Don Schwartz <dks@t...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
On 9/12/2014 7:43 PM, Darrell & Kathy wrote:
> And a few years back I got this odd kit at a yard sale in Verona ON.
> It shows some of the steps in manufacturing a pencil.
> I suspect some bits are missing, but it was cool enough to
> entice me into buying it.
>
> http://galootcentral.com/components/cpgalbums/userpics/10074/pencil_k
it.jpg">http://galootcentral.com/components/cpgalbums/userpics/10074/pencil_kit.
jpg

If you crave one of these kits - or know someone who would ...

http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/MS-
HOWPEN">http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/MS-HOWPEN

Don
250380 Steve Jones <stjones@k...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
CG;

I don't think the ones on Amazon are round - the base of the cone produced
by sharpening is round if the pencil is round, scalloped if the pencil is
hexagonal. My $.02

Steve in Kokomo

On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 8:27 PM, CheekyGeek  wrote:

> That's hilarious, Chuck.
>
> As some of you probably know the Holy Grail of pencils was the Eberhard
> Faber Blackwing 602. They are round, not hexagonal. You have a chance to
> get a box of 8 on eBay right now, if you like:
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-BLACKWING-602-VINTAGE-EBERHARD-FABER-
PENCILS-WITH-ORIGINAL-BOX-/331315141490">http://www.ebay.com/itm/8-BLACKWING-602
-VINTAGE-EBERHARD-FABER-PENCILS-WITH-ORIGINAL-BOX-/331315141490
>
> They routinely bring $40-50 each.
>
> Well recently a company called Palomino is trading on the name:
> http://www.amazon.com/Palomino-Blackwing-
Pencils-12-Count/dp/B006CQWILK">http://www.amazon.com/Palomino-Blackwing-
Pencils-12-Count/dp/B006CQWILK
> They get good reviews, but it is not clear to me if they are really the
> same formulation, but I think I'm going to give them a try. I recall my
> dad, who was an assistant manager at a Safeway store (before they closed
> down the whole central U.S. division) bringing home pencils that (I seem to
> recall were branded IBM) and they were, I believe Eberhard Faber Dark Wing
> 602s. Writing or sketching with them was BLISS, not like the hard graphite
> crap in pencils today.
>
> Just wondering if anyone else remembers these wonderful old tools.
>
> Darren Addy
> Kearney, Nebraska
>
>
250381 "John M. Johnston" <sgt42rhr@a...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Shape is less important to me than hardness. I like a No. 4 or better for most
fine layout work where a pencil is a better choice than a knife. I've been
getting them from art supply stores.

Cheers,
John

John M. Johnston
“P.S. If you do not receive this, of course it must have been miscarried;
therefore I beg you to write and let me know.” - Sir Boyle Roche,
M.P.------------------------------------------------------------------------
250382 Steve Jones <stjones@k...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
No, no, no. The problem with making a hexagonal pencil round by subtraction
(planing, turning, dowel machine, dowel plate) is that you make it smaller
in diameter. That would negate both the comfort factor and the fit in the
divider. You could make long, skinny scales to glue onto the flats (with
hide glue, of course), but that seems excessive.

Steve in Kokomo
devoting entirely too much thought to this....

On Fri, Sep 12, 2014 at 8:49 PM, Gary Roberts  wrote:

> Here is what I do:
>
> In a V shaped jig, place the hexagonal pencil lengthwise. With a low angle
> block plane, ground to 31 degrees, begin relieving each arris, working your
> way around the pencil. As you consecutively relieve the arris produced by
> each pass of the plane, you will notice that the arris’ will increase in
> number, but increase in the degree at which they meet. When you have
> completed this process, the final arris of each joining will be
> undetectable to the touch.
>
> Best of luck!
> Gary
> ...............................
> Gary Roberts
> http://toolemera.com
> http://toolemerabooks.com
>
> "I'ld rather read a good book, than write a poor one." Christopher Morley
>
>
>
>
> On Sep 12, 2014, at 9:28 AM, Steve Jones  wrote:
>
> GGs;
>
> If you are the other galoot who prefers round wooden pencils to the
> hexagonal variety and have trouble finding them, I just got six from these
> folks: http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/">http://fieldnotesbrand.com/shop/ (I
also like their notebooks but
> do
> not advise leaving a red-covered one in your pants pocket when it goes into
> the washing machine). Lee Valley used to carry round #2 pencils but don't
> any more. They're a little spendy, but I figure I have a good five-year
> supply, so the amortization works out OK.
>
> --
> Steve in Kokomo
>
>
>


-- 
Steve Jones
250383 David Nighswander <wishingstarfarm663@m...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Snip
From: Steve Jones






No, no, no. The problem with making a hexagonal pencil round by subtraction
(planing, turning, dowel machine, dowel plate) is that you make it smaller
in diameter. That would negate both the comfort factor and the fit in the
divider. You could make long, skinny scales to glue onto the flats (with
hide glue, of course), but that seems excessive.

Steve in Kokomo
devoting entirely too much thought to this....
Unsnip

Excessive? Perhaps. Genius in concept though. 
I propose coopering a pencil holder that will accept the less appealing shape
and envelop it in a wooden sheath of the appropriate diameter and heft. Perhaps
jarra or cocobolo in the absence of ebony, the hands down favorite.
Or just buy the 8 pencils at $50.00 each and sit in a darkened room muttering,
“My Precious, My Precious”
Written by a guy who has spent many an hour cleaning the saw plate, refinishing
the handle, sharpening the teeth, and (take a deep breath) polishing the brass
on a D8. It just looks stunning in the saw rack, and feels way too good in use.
250384 Bob Miller <bobprime@b...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Another really good place to look for round pencils is an art store.  I use
Derwent sketching pencils that come in a variety of hardnesses and they are
all round.  Really comfortable in the hand too and nice lead.  Also you can
often find all kind of other weird and neat things in an art store like
various kinds of linseed oil.

Bob
250385 Michael Blair <branson2@s...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
> Well recently a company called Palomino is trading on the name:

The photo shows one of these sharpened, and as someone pointed out,
these are hexagonal.

> Writing or sketching with them was BLISS, not like the hard graphite
> crap in pencils today.

Hard graphite is not modern crap.  Graphite has come in different levels
of hardness for many decades.

> Just wondering if anyone else remembers these wonderful old tools.

Remember them?  I sold them at my grandfather's art and office supply
store.  Those that aren't advertising give away pencils are marked with
their hardness.  Most common hardness is No. 2, followed by No. 2 1/2
(some companies call this one No. 2 A).  I used to get the No.4 pencils
for writing and taking notes because they don't smudge.

You can find what the numbers mean on the Ticonderoga site at:

http://www.dixonticonderoga.com/

Ticonderoga is one of the premium pencils on the market, always has 
been.

Round pencils are still available, too.  They are frequently found in
advertising freebies (easier to put the logo on a round).  The one in 
front
of me right now is a freebie from the Society of California Archivists 
that
I picked up at the California Archives Crawl last year.  Good pencil, 
good
graphite.  They just aren't difficult to find.

You really like fatter pencils?  Try Koh-I-Noor Triogrph pencils:

http:/
/kohinoorusa.com/products/pencils/graphite/trio/index.php

They're not round, but triangular, and very comfortable.  The triangular
cross section is a good deal more ergonomic than a simple round.

Trying to find the optimal hardness or softness for your use?  Look at
the Koh-I-Noor Toison D'Or offered in 20 degrees from 10H to 8B offered
in 20 degrees from 10H to 8B:

http://koh
inoorusa.com/products/pencils/graphite/index.html

Koh-I-Noor has always made premier grade graphite pencils, especially
for artists and draftsmen.

Like Eberhard?  Eberhard was acquired by Staedtler in 1978, and 
Staedtler
is still in business, manufacturing and selling premium grade pencils,
though only the hexagonal sort.  I bought a Staedtler drawing pencil  
for
sketching when I was in Australia back in '06, and it's a fine pencil.

Paying $40 to $50 each for a vintage pencil just for use is, well,
ridiculous.  Office supply use pencils may have gone to inferior
quality, but artists still demand quality.  There's no advantage to
buying a 30 year old collector pencil when brand new pencils of the
same quality are easily available.

Mike in Sacto
250386 Christopher Swingley <cswingle@s...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
Galoots,

On Sat, Sep 13, 2014 at 4:39 AM, Michael Blair  wrote:
>> Well recently a company called Palomino is trading on the name:
>>
>> Writing or sketching with them was BLISS, not like the hard graphite
>> crap in pencils today.
>
> Hard graphite is not modern crap.  Graphite has come in different levels
> of hardness for many decades.

The Palomino Blackwings are very nice, as are their other premium
pencils.  The Blackwings are a bit soft for many uses, but I think
their premium HB variants strike a good balance and have excellent
lead, cases and finish.  What I find objectionable in a crap pencil is
a case that doesn't center the lead so it's difficult to get a good
point, and graphite that is uneven, which often feels like it's too
hard and scratchy whenever you hit a bad spot.  That might be what the
original poster meant by "hard graphite".

> http://www.dixonticonderoga.com/">http://www.dixonticonderoga.com/
>
> Ticonderoga is one of the premium pencils on the market, always has been.

I'd argue it is no longer.  Production has shifted to Mexico and China
(maybe elsewhere too), and I don't think the quality of the pencil is
as good as it was when it was produced in the United States.  I'm
partial to General (US) and Palomino (Japan, US) for premium pencils.

> Paying $40 to $50 each for a vintage pencil just for use is, well,
> ridiculous.  Office supply use pencils may have gone to inferior
> quality, but artists still demand quality.  There's no advantage to
> buying a 30 year old collector pencil when brand new pencils of the
> same quality are easily available.

To each his own.  Most people probably think it's crazy to spend $20
for a box of 12 pencils, but using them makes me happy so I'm not
going to feel bad about it.

Cheers,

Chris
-- 
Christopher Swingley
Fairbanks, Alaska
http://swingleydev.com/
cswingle@s...
250387 JAMES THOMPSON <oldmillrat@m...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
On Sep 13, 2014, at 10:23 AM, Christopher Swingley  wrote:

> To each his own.  Most people probably think it's crazy to spend $20
> for a box of 12 pencils, but using them makes me happy so I'm not
> going to feel bad about it.

Can we get an "AMEN!!!??" I do a number of things that can be done cheaper, but
what I do makes me happy, and I can afford it, so why not?

You can buy cheap whiskey and get a buzz on, or you can buy a bottle of fine
scotch (or bourbon, or whatever blows your skirt up). Now, if you are so
inclined, you can get a buzz on with that as well. I like sipping it slowly, and
the buzz will get there when it does.
250390 Steve Reynolds <s.e.reynolds@v...> 2014‑09‑13 Re: Round pencils
On Sep 13, 2014, at 1:23 PM, Christopher Swingley  wrote:

> Galoots,
> 
> On Sat, Sep 13, 2014 at 4:39 AM, Michael Blair  wrote:
>>> Well recently a company called Palomino is trading on the name:
>>> 
>>> Writing or sketching with them was BLISS, not like the hard graphite
>>> crap in pencils today.
>> 
>> Hard graphite is not modern crap.  Graphite has come in different levels
>> of hardness for many decades.
> 
> The Palomino Blackwings are very nice, as are their other premium
> pencils.  The Blackwings are a bit soft for many uses, but I think
> their premium HB variants strike a good balance and have excellent
> lead, cases and finish. 

        I once worked in a group that luxuriously ordered stationary for
everyone’s individual preference.  I like the Ticonderoga’s just fine, but my
buddy would have them stock the Blackwings.  I never could get a liking for
them, too soft for my taste, but I really like the eraser on them.

        One of the funniest moments I have had with Todd Hughes was the time a
bunch of us pounced on a tailgate being set up late at PATINA.  I came away with
a pack of oldschool, round, cedar pencils.  When we started comparing our hauls
while walking away from the tailgate it was clear that Todd thought I was brain
damaged for being so happy with a pack of pencils.  What can I say, I like the
old cedar pencils.

Regards,
Steve------------------------------------------------------------------------
250391 "Adrian Jones" <adrianjones747@c...> 2014‑09‑13 RE: Round pencils
"... it was clear that Todd thought I was brain damaged for being so happy
with a pack of pencils..."
Regards,
Steve-----------------------------------------------------------------------
-

Reminds me of the time I was in cube ville.

I had developed a passion for old fountain pens (old tool, if ever there
was).
There was a fair bit of handwriting with the job so it worked out well.
There is less stress on your hand, compared to writing with a ballpoint.
One of the joys was going to the break room and flushing out and cleaning
the pens (I had at least half a dozen, each with a different ink).  Heaven,
because it looks like you are working.

Anyways, the guy in the next cubicle commented on the "fancy pen" I was
using.  I jumped up and laid into the history of fountain pens, the many
varied filling mechanisms, the lovely shades of ink, all the different
manufacturers, here and abroad.

After about a minute I could actually see his eyes glaze over and he says
"Oh my God, is that the time, I'm late for a meeting" and he ran away.
A minute later I seen him sneaking back on tip-toe to his cube.
I should have jumped up again but I was content with an evil smile to
myself.

Cheers!
250396 Steve Jones <stjones@k...> 2014‑09‑13 RE: Round pencils
Alf? Are you there?

Sent from my Galaxy S5
On Sep 13, 2014 5:04 PM, "Adrian Jones" 
wrote:

> "... it was clear that Todd thought I was brain damaged for being so happy
> with a pack of pencils..."
> Regards,
>
> Steve-----------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
>
> Reminds me of the time I was in cube ville.
>
> I had developed a passion for old fountain pens (old tool, if ever there
> was).
> There was a fair bit of handwriting with the job so it worked out well.
> There is less stress on your hand, compared to writing with a ballpoint.
> One of the joys was going to the break room and flushing out and cleaning
> the pens (I had at least half a dozen, each with a different ink).  Heaven,
> because it looks like you are working.
>
> Anyways, the guy in the next cubicle commented on the "fancy pen" I was
> using.  I jumped up and laid into the history of fountain pens, the many
> varied filling mechanisms, the lovely shades of ink, all the different
> manufacturers, here and abroad.
>
> After about a minute I could actually see his eyes glaze over and he says
> "Oh my God, is that the time, I'm late for a meeting" and he ran away.
> A minute later I seen him sneaking back on tip-toe to his cube.
> I should have jumped up again but I was content with an evil smile to
> myself.
>
> Cheers!
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> OldTools is a mailing list catering to the interests of hand tool
> aficionados, both collectors and users, to discuss the history, usage,
> value, location, availability, collectibility, and restoration of
> traditional handtools, especially woodworking tools.
>
> To change your subscription options:
> http://rucku
s.law.cornell.edu/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
>
> To read the FAQ:
> http://swingleydev.com/archi
ve/faq.html
>
> OldTools archive: http://swingleydev.com/archive/">http://swingleydev.com/archive/
>
> OldTools@r...
> http://rucku
s.law.cornell.edu/mailman/listinfo/oldtools
>
250399 Michael Blair <branson2@s...> 2014‑09‑14 RE: Round pencils
Ya know, nobody was condemning anyone for buying really great pencils.
But paying the reported $40 to $50 for one pencil, one that is no longer
made and is no better than top flight pencils still in production is 
both
foolish and wasteful if you are just buying it to use it up.

Artist grade Kohinoor and Staedtler graphite pencils sell for around 
$1.50
each.  Not cheap, but far from the going prices on Eberhard pencils.  
They
are every bit as good, and are not a non-renewable resource.

If you want artist quality pencils, go to the nearest art supply store 
and
ask for "artist grade" pencils, not "student grade."  Some are hex, and
others are round.

I don't mind paying for good pencils.  I have Kohinoors and Staedtlers,
and I use them.  That's not the issue.

Mike in Sacto
250404 "Chuck Taylor" <cft98208@g...> 2014‑09‑14 Re: Round pencils
Steve wrote:

> No, no, no. The problem with making a hexagonal pencil round by subtraction
> (planing, turning, dowel machine, dowel plate) is that you make it smaller
> in diameter. That would negate both the comfort factor and the fit in the
> divider.

No problem! Just pound the pencil through the dowel plate to make it round, then
wrap it with duct tape to restore it to the desired diameter. :-)

Cheers,
Chuck Taylor
north of Seattle
250405 Steve Jones <stjones@k...> 2014‑09‑14 Re: Round pencils
Now you're on to something - wrap with several layers of silk
fly-rod-building thread and give it a coat of varnish. Classy!

On Sat, Sep 13, 2014 at 9:35 PM, Chuck Taylor  wrote:

> Steve wrote:
>
> > No, no, no. The problem with making a hexagonal pencil round by
> subtraction
> > (planing, turning, dowel machine, dowel plate) is that you make it
> smaller
> > in diameter. That would negate both the comfort factor and the fit in the
> > divider.
>
> No problem! Just pound the pencil through the dowel plate to make it
> round, then wrap it with duct tape to restore it to the desired diameter.
> :-)
>
> Cheers,
> Chuck Taylor
> north of Seattle
>



-- 
Steve Jones
250406 Don Schwartz <dks@t...> 2014‑09‑14 Re: Round pencils
On 9/13/2014 7:35 PM, Chuck Taylor wrote:
> Steve wrote:
>
>> >No, no, no. The problem with making a hexagonal pencil round by subtraction
>> >(planing, turning, dowel machine, dowel plate) is that you make it smaller
>> >in diameter. That would negate both the comfort factor and the fit in the
>> >divider.
> No problem! Just pound the pencil through the dowel plate to make it round,
then wrap it with duct tape to restore it to the desired diameter.

OR you could turn a bunch of tiny hollow rings on your mini-lathe and 
glue them on to give a nicely ribbed surface!

Don
250408 John Holladay <docholladay0820@g...> 2014‑09‑14 Re: Round pencils
Normal pencil cost $0.10.

Galoots pencil cost  $40.00.
On Sep 13, 2014 8:57 PM, "Don Schwartz"  wrote:

>
> On 9/13/2014 7:35 PM, Chuck Taylor wrote:
>
>> Steve wrote:
>>
>>  >No, no, no. The problem with making a hexagonal pencil round by
>>> subtraction
>>> >(planing, turning, dowel machine, dowel plate) is that you make it
>>> smaller
>>> >in diameter. That would negate both the comfort factor and the fit in
>>> the
>>> >divider.
>>>
>> No problem! Just pound the pencil through the dowel plate to make it
>> round, then wrap it with duct tape to restore it to the desired diameter.
>>
>
> OR you could turn a bunch of tiny hollow rings on your mini-lathe and glue
> them on to give a nicely ribbed surface!
>
> Don
>
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250409 Thomas Conroy <booktoolcutter@y...> 2014‑09‑14 Re: Round pencils
Michael Blair wrote:

"Remember them?  I sold them at my grandfather's art and office supply
store.  Those that aren't advertising give away pencils are marked with
their hardness.  Most common hardness is No. 2, followed by No. 2 1/2
(some companies call this one No. 2 A).  I used to get the No.4 pencils
for writing and taking notes because they don't smudge."


Just a bit to add to Michael's comments. One problem with modern office-supply
brands is that they aren't consistent from maker to maker. They are all numbered
#2, but they are all over the place in hardness. I'm more annoyed by the lack of
concentricity of the leads, so that sharpening leaves a long splinter of wood
all the way to the tip; and by the brittleness of modern lead, so that the point
breaks off below the wood before you even finish sharpening.


Artists' pencils do seem the way to go, if you are picky, and actually buy your
pencils (mine seem to appear magically, especially after I visit libraries, or
sometimes on the sidewalk.) It helps if you understand the numbering system,
which is different from ordinary pencils. From a central point labelled "HB" the
numbers rise in two directions, toward H which is hard and therefore pale, and
toward B which is black and therefore soft. The steps are by two numerals, so
that a run from a moderately hard to a moderately black would be 4H - 2H - HB -
2B -4B. I still have a lot of my mother's, and others I bought myself in the
early '80s. The numbers for common-or-sidewalk pencils, back when they meant
anything, seem to have corresponded roughly to the hard side of the
artist's-pencil scale, so that a No.4 was something like a 4H and a No.2
approximated a 2H. I even remember seeing, long ago, yellow hexagonal pencils
labeled "HB".

With artists' pencils you will probably want a push-on eraser or a separate
eraser. The white plastic kind are less abrasive, and they don't leave crumbs of
rubber embedded in the paper. Or, I expect, in the wood. The rubber is bad
because it decays quickly, though I don't recall ever seeing damage I could
blame on that cause. It seems to me that the white plastic ones work better as
well, but I've got no objective basis for that.

Tom Conroy
If you like the kind that are two feet long, and can be tied in knots, I can't
help you. Ask a school kid.

Berkeley
250410 "Adam R. Maxwell" <amaxwell@m...> 2014‑09‑14 Re: Round pencils
> On Sep 13, 2014, at 23:43 , Thomas Conroy  wrote:
> 
> a run from a moderately hard to a moderately black would be 4H - 2H - HB - 2B
-4B.

Omitting F and H, which are between HB and 2H. I still
have some F lead for mechanical pencils, from a drafting
class in the mid-90's. The Berol turquoise drawing pencils
get occasional use in the shop (4H & 6H).

> I still have a lot of my mother's, and others I bought myself in the early
'80s. The numbers for common-or-sidewalk pencils, back when they meant anything,
seem to have corresponded roughly to the hard side of the artist's-pencil scale,
so that a No.4 was something like a 4H and a No.2 approximated a 2H. I even
remember seeing, long ago, yellow hexagonal pencils labeled "HB".

FWIW, I was told that a No. 2 was equivalent to an HB. 
Wackypedia concurs, but I didn't bother chasing down an 
authoritative source, much less my drafting text.

> With artists' pencils you will probably want a push-on eraser or a separate
eraser. The white plastic kind are less abrasive, and they don't leave crumbs of
rubber embedded in the paper. Or, I expect, in the wood.

For paper, my favorite eraser is the Tuff Stuff Eraser Stick.

http://www.amazon.com/Paper-Mate-Stuff-Eraser-
SN64801/dp/B0006HXI74">http://www.amazon.com/Paper-Mate-Stuff-Eraser-
SN64801/dp/B0006HXI74

It eliminated most of my usage of the erasing shield, but I use
a Staedtler Mars plastic eraser on wood, just because it has
more material to waste.

Adam

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