On Friday 14 October 2005 16:16, Sanford Moss wrote:
> I gotta say that this thread sort of sets my teeth on edge.

It shouldn't. You're not using my tools, as I'm not using yours. So it 
doesn't bother me what you do with your tools. In this regard, I would say if 
you're looking for old tools that WaltQ is the person for you to see, rather 
than JohnnyK, or other avenues.

I do agree with you that it's better to keep the tools in original condition. 
But this doesn't help me as a user get a nice tool to use, it's only gets me 
an original tool. In many cases these original tools require a lot of tuning 
to get them in workable order. Many people don't have those acquired skills. 
Some can't afford to invest the time in learning how to do it, and want to 
use them to build things rather than collecting tools.

> But this can lead to dealers 
> taking a plane that has some collectible feature (rarity, maker, etc) and 
> subjecting it to unseemly (and destructive) cleaning; especailly when we
> are 
> talking about rejapanning, sole flattening, side squaring, buffing, etc.  
> Methinks that these "tuning" activities ought to be left to the ultimate 
> user.

Problem is the "ultimate user" is often not capable of doing that work, and I 
don't see how buying a vintage refurbished plane for 30-50 percent of what a 
LN plane costs is bad, especially if they use it for woodworking as intended.

> But in its present "tuned" condition it is worth less than a later one,
> lacking the important lateral lever and frog adjustment features.
> Essentially it has been destroyed. The "tuner's" labor (hours for sure)
> resulted in a negative value.  I'd be embarrassed to try to sell it.

I disagree with you. If the person is only collecting old tools, the value is 
less, but if the person wants to use the tools to build projects with, it 
could be worth more in a usable state. Maybe this is not important to you, 
but you're free to acquire and do what you like with your tools. I don't just 
want old tools for the sake of collecting them, I want to use them. I like 
the No 8 Johnny refurbished for me, it's a wonderful tool that I could pick 
up and work with anytime. After I got the blade cleaned up and sharpened 
nicely, it's a great plane. I own only about 5 or 6 hand planes, and want 
usable planes that function a they need to. Several are completely original 
and how you would like them. The No 8 is the one that is not.

> Maybe it's naive on my 
> part, but that experience would probably make the user better able to cope 
> with planing problems down the road.  Just a thought.

I think it is naive to assume they have the time and/or knowledge to do it, 
or even expect them to do it. The other option is to go buy a new LV or LN 
plane and be happy to pay more and get a good working plane. I've seen enough 
old tools to know that many of them are not worth a dime until setup, tuned, 
and especially sharpened. Your Victor might be completely useless to a 
professional cabinet builder that needs a functional plane, while to you it's 
great because it's worth more in it's original state.

-- 

Alan DuBoff
Software Orchestration
GPG: 1024D/B7A9EBEE 5E00 57CD 5336 5E0B 288B 4126 0D49 0D99 B7A9 EBEE

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